March 3, 2002 at 8:59 pm #62531
In his book, The Afterlife Experiments, Dr. Gary Schwartz often asks his classes the following:
“Imagine that after all the inevitable challenges, it turns out that it’s not dust to dust, but energy to energy – how would this discovery change your life if you knew, once and for all, that consciousness stayed with us forever?” (I changed a few words, but this pretty well sums up what the question is asking).
Now, I realize that this is one scientist asking other potential scientists a ‘what if’ question but after reading the book I had a few ideas of my own and wondered what others might think. Any ideas?March 4, 2002 at 6:55 am #68864WPBEAR14Participant
It reminded me of a querie I had just the other day. I said to my husband–after some sensational news story was on TV….that wouldn’t it be interesting if what “I believe” is true and we choose our own way to cross when the time comes. If this fact was known then all the sensational news stories would no longer need to exist. Yeah!
I do feel we are energy or light beings and are around after our physical bodies crash. It just takes openness and helpful places like this website to acknowledge the energy on the other side.
Back to your question: Knowing that we are energy beings seems to take away much of the “fear” of living or dying. Fear is what runs the world right now and taking away fear would be great!
Love, light and peace to all energies…
POOHMarch 4, 2002 at 1:42 pm #68894Pam BKeymaster
What a concept –
What if “death” became something that we could view as a beautiful, miraculous event, like a birth? A re-birth.
Can you imagine a future where we could actually celebrate the passing from this life into the next as a gift? Could we ever grow spiritually to the point where the happiness we feel for our loved one’s joy at going to the “Other Side” could overshadow our own feelings of loss of that person’s physical body?
If we had confidence that we were still connected, still sharing love, and could still communicate — could we look at that person’s passing like we were sending a child off to college? As if we knew we’d miss the person, but it was for that person’s best interest, and that we’d know we’d be reunited, and that the person’s leaving us was not total, and not permanant?
Braveheart said “Every man dies, but not every man truly lives”. Can you imagine what Man would accomplish if we lived as if we were not afraid to die?March 4, 2002 at 2:39 pm #68816GailParticipant
There is a whole section in the book on how our lives might change if sometime in the near future the newspaper banner headline reads, “Science Proves Human Soul Lives Forever, Conclusive Lab Experiments Show Consciousness Survives After Death”.
Gail:)March 4, 2002 at 9:43 pm #68274
At first I was not exactly sure why the question even needed to be asked.
What would be the sense of having both locations common knowledge? In other words, if I knew that I could call on the energies on the next plane as though I were making a phone call then would it even be necessary for me to be here? I could get the answers to anything I wanted and not have to work for it…maybe; but probably not.
So then I began to look at it like higher education. I know that it is there. I know that I could get tons of questions answered while learning other things that don’t require college such as every day living, earnestly CAVing, overall growth that college doesn’t really teach – kinda like becoming street smart. And yet knowing that I will enter those doors to absorb a greater life lesson is one of the most rewarding experiences any of us will ever have.
Creating a well-rounded person requires many life experiences and I believe that not only do we absorb energy from those around us but that we also give energy back to those around us as an exchange of knowledge. We bring things with us when we choose to have another go at life so that we can continue the process for ourselves and others.
I would say that nearly every day there are more and more opportunities for us to realize that the comfort of life after life should be one of the greatest joys we can experience.
The possibilities are endless and challenging.April 29, 2002 at 3:49 pm #76762
. . . if we could choose our own death.
According to some things I’ve read, prior to our entering this present existence, we choose 5 times in which to die and we may exist this plane at any of those five times. I’m on my number five. :)July 16, 2002 at 3:26 pm #78476
I have a feeling that things will never get to that state. If our purpose for being on earth is to learn, then it seems like it’s important that we don’t just have instant access to the other side whenever we want it. It would be like taking a test in the middle of a library…you wouldn’t have to learn anything, other than how to get the right book.
I think the general knowledge that the soul goes on is hugely significant (and seems to be the main message given to us), but beyond that, I think the limits on how much we can know/access will remain in place.July 16, 2002 at 4:05 pm #78480
“I have a feeling that things will never get to that state. “
The psychic could be wrong. She’s been wrong before about a few points. Sylvia Brown was where I got the information.
f” If our purpose for being on earth is to learn, then it seems like it’s important that we don’t just have instant access to the other side whenever we want it. It would be like taking a test in the middle of a library…you wouldn’t have to learn anything, other than how to get the right book.”
It wouldn’t be so much like instant access as it is prearranged moments for choice in our passing. We arrange ahead of time, what we would like to accomplish – various goals. However, we realize that our reincarnation to earth is a tough one. We are unsure if we can “take it” being a physical being and allow ourselves five “out” times that we can without incurring negative evolution on ourselves or damaging others (as in what has been throught of as ‘bad karma’). These “out” times are prearranged and agree upon by all involved — or at least those effected are made aware that you made your decision about them.
True that we don’t learn as much going out on number one as we learn going out on number five, but that’s okay. We each do the best we can at the moment.
Take an infant who chooses to die at birth. It opts for number one just because it wanted to experience the birth process. It had only one goal for the moment and succeeded in its goal.
” I think the general knowledge that the soul goes on is hugely significant (and seems to be the main message given to us),
“It is certainly one of the major messages we can ‘learn’.”
“. . . but beyond that, I think the limits on how much we can know/access will remain in place.”
THere is no limit to what we can learn except that we place that limit on ourselves or God in his wisdom, delays such wisdom to when we are ready to experience it or it is of best benefit to those others around us.
Light and love. Kasin.July 16, 2002 at 5:33 pm #78486
At one time I made the mistake of making a comment regarding a person that was dying of cancer. I said that it was a preplanned event and that she chose to go that way. Wow, the feathers flew and I got a dressing down big time. She said that at no time would anyone agree to go through such an experience and leave three little girls behind with no mother.
I truly believed that WAS her plan but needed to say to help protect the moment that it was the way I believed.
When you talked about the baby dying at birth you commented that it was the only goal that infant had was to experience birth – I have often wondered if it was also meant to be a learning experience for the parents just as it would be a learning lesson for the husband and children of the lady that was dying from cancer. My grandmother taught me that something good must come out of all bad things in order for us to learn otherwise we would repeat it until that was accomplished.
As far as knowledge is concerned, each lifetime will leave you with all kinds of knowledge. To me it stands to reason that because of our free will we either take advantage of that knowledge or not. As time goes on in my life I constantly hear the word ‘observer’. I must have been a high flyer in another lifetime (hard for me to envision) because I discover that I am constantly watching others and listening to concerns of others. So for each of us our awareness is key for the next time around, if we so choose….July 16, 2002 at 6:00 pm #78488
Sorry, Kasin…I wasn’t really replying to your comment, but an earlier one.
About choosing your time and manner of death, I believe that you do, more or less. I have problems with Sylvia Browne’s view on things, and I’ve never heard anyone else mention the ‘5 moments’, so I’m going to reserve my judgement on that. I do think, however, that it is possible to go in ways that you didn’t plan, murder and suicide being two possibilities. I suspect that, once you are here, it is possible to stray from the plan you had in mind before coming down, and therefore the ending might not be quite what you had wanted.
About babies dying, one example in Many Lives, Many Masters, suggested that a soul died as a young baby in order to even out a karmic debt the parents had, as well as to nudge the father onto a particular path.July 16, 2002 at 6:06 pm #78490
“At one time I made the mistake of making a comment regarding a person that was dying of cancer. I said that it was a preplanned event and that she chose to go that way. Wow, the feathers flew and I got a dressing down big time. She said that at no time would anyone agree to go through such an experience and leave three little girls behind with no mother.”
I have heard several times that there are no victims in life – a concept I don’t as yet agree with but am trying to understand.
I’m sure the lady was responding with the working conscious knowledge she had and perhaps (I’m guessing) hadn’t had the benefit of your experiences in spiritual realties.
This kind of interaction makes me again think of the NDE individual that learned during the experience that all things work for God’s glory, ultimate love and light. I guess where there is no darkness, no pain there is no light, no joy? Again, a difficult concept, but this Does jive with me — no pain, no gain.
“I have often wondered if it was also meant to be a learning experience for the parents just as it would be a learning lesson for the husband and children of the lady that was dying from cancer. “
Very well could be. It depends on those pre-entry agreements prior to the reincarnation.
“My grandmother taught me that something good must come out of all bad things in order for us to learn otherwise we would repeat it until that was accomplished.”
Your grandmother sounds like a wise woman. It goes along with what I’ve read about Tibetan religion and advancing ones self through knowledge acquisition which leads, hopefully, to making the correct choice even during the post-death sequence.
You are an observer. Do you find yourself observing with emotional connections such as empathy or like a recording machine and no emotions?July 16, 2002 at 6:19 pm #78491
I agree with you about Syliva. Although it does make sense to me about the five times personally I counted the number of opportunities I had to die, and it has come four with the next being the last. As far as her other dictates, she does make errors, which is of course, acceptable — she is also doing the best she can with information she’s given and in her own framework of relating. I have seen some corolations along her lines with other authors, so it seems she is right on in some aspects.
I agree with you on suicide, but not on murder. I think that is a fair option, but not for the one doing the killing — it is a violation of spiritual law A no no. If you notice, on John’s program, the folks who were subject to passing in this manner really aren’t all that concerned about it and even accept the murdering in some cases, understanding why it occured. Forgiveness in action? Or just better perspective? Makes me go ‘hummmm ‘. . . .
“I suspect that, once you are here, it is possible to stray from the plan you had in mind before coming down, and therefore the ending might not be quite what you had wanted.”
Agreed. I agree this does happen.
Babies dying and karmic debt. Makes sense. I have that book and am hoping to get to it soon. I’ve heard so many great things about it.July 16, 2002 at 7:02 pm #78493
True, I think that some murder deaths are planned out in advance. Scattered throughout the various books I’ve read on the subject are suggestions that sometimes the murderer is NOT abiding by a prearanged agreement, however. I suspect it can happen both ways. Still looking for more info on the subject, though. :)July 16, 2002 at 7:30 pm #78494
I am an observer with total empathy. Sometimes I am shaking my head up and down saying oh yes, I understand completely and at other times I am caught by surprise and will be rivited to the situation. I very often don’t make any comments but just listen. Almost always it will turn out to be a learning event for me.
But I must admit I have also been caught by surprise and be totally shocked and invariably will open my big mouth and promptly insert my foot LOL. Sometimes I surprise myself with how spontaneous I can be…ooops, sorry I missed that lesson on self control:o
However I have also discovered that I can and often will be the first one to laugh at myself for being such a knot-head!!!
You would have loved my grandmother. She was one of the sweetest souls God ever gave breath to. I truly miss her and was so fortunate to have her in my life. She was a wonderfully wise woman. She was the only girl with three other brothers and actually took care of her dad and brothers when her mother died – my grandmother was 10 years old at the time – amazing woman. She did have the help of her strict Scotch grandparents. But she said she survived them despite their ‘help’….
She loved life and it showed. I do hope that I can give some of that gift to my grandchildren.May 6, 2005 at 4:30 am #95860allegeParticipant
I have read that the matter can be transformed into energy and vice-versa.
So the point “dust to dust or energy to energy seems to be the same thing”.
But the consciousness (in my point of view) is a file that is recorded in the global universe energy( God – if you want it), and can be restored. sometimes, during the reincarnations.
If our spirits (energy) is a piece of the global one, so the individual consciousness is not so important in the end, because we all grow together…..
Ah I speak Portuguese , sorry for the errors…..
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